Unofficial Mega Science Debate Thread

[Munsie]

Thread is now for debating anything Science related you'd like. Commence.


Just to get everyone somewhat on the same page; Here is a Wiki page.

Moving on; Let's say our definition of perpetual motion is just something that will continue to move without any additional energy being added to the system, it's isolated for extra energy being added.

Do you think it's it possible?

Do you have any theories on how it could be done?

I was thinking about it today, and the only one possible idea I could think of for how to do it would involve a ton of slanted and custom shaped mirrors placed in a circular tube, and a (magnetic) metal marble.

Discuss.

[Sgt.Peppers]

I saw a MythBusters episode about this once, they couldn't get anything to work...

[G.I.R.]

Energy cannot be created, nor destroyed.

I don't think it's possible.

[TomClancey]

On the MythBusters one, didn't they get it to restore 33% of the energy used or something? (I can't remember the statistics of the experiment, I haven't seen that episode in a long while.)

[Munsie]

Energy cannot be created, nor destroyed.

I don't think it's possible.

Nobody is creating or destorying any energy.

Just a lot of transferring energy (and in my case magnet whoring).

[G.I.R.]

Such a device or system would be in violation of the law of Conservation of Energy, which states that energy can never be created nor destroyed, and is therefore deemed impossible by mainstream physics.

[Munsie]

However, perpetual motion usually refers to a device or system that delivers more energy than is put into it. Such a device or system would be in violation of the law of Conservation of Energy, which states that energy can never be created nor destroyed, and is therefore deemed impossible by mainstream physics.

Atleast quote the whole thing. A device that made more energy than it started with would be impossible. Not one that just used the available energy to it's maximum potential without wasting any.

[shadowkhas]

Ooh! Ooh! How about friction for why this is totally outrageous?

Do I get a point, teacher?

[Munsie]

Solution: Eliminate friction.

My idea still stands. Get a donut shaped tube, line the inside with earth magnets. Place them slanted slightly so each one would repel the steel marble further around the tube. If all surfaces on the inside are covered with magnets, in theory it should float. Thus eliminating friction.

I see no reason why this would ever stop either.

Yes?

[GametagAeonFlux]

It would be extremely difficult to set that up at just the right angles, if not impossible.

[shadowkhas]

Solution: Eliminate friction.

My idea still stands. Get a donut shaped tube, line the inside with earth magnets. Place them slanted slightly so each one would repel the steel marble further around the tube. If all surfaces on the inside are covered with magnets, in theory it should float. Thus eliminating friction.

I see no reason why this would ever stop either.

Yes?

So how would you generate energy?
You have a metal marble in the air. Woo.

[newbymodder]

theres always a possibility for anything. With the right amount of time, people ,and patience they might be able to pull it off. As for friction and air resistance um space has none? it could work in a confined area of space (space as in the moon, stars, planet space not a space you put stuff) but as for using magnets you still have to think of air unless you simulate space in a confined area while using magnets.

Energy can't be created or destroyed, but you could transfer energy from something and add it to the energy you have. im just throwing stuff out here im not physics major.

[Munsie]

@GTAF: Yes, but it is technically possible, I think?

@shadowkhas: Um? You have a metal marble in the air going around and around propelled by magnets.

@newbymodder: Yes, there is still friction against the air, isn't that when the magnets step in to push it along? You could always assemble this inside a vaccum chamber.

[newbymodder]

ya i don't see why its not capable of being done, but truth be told how could you apply this to human living?

[metkillerjoe]

Have a magnet in space. Spin it once, and it spins for eternity.

[GametagAeonFlux]

Have a magnet in space. Spin it once, and it spins for eternity.

While it may be virtually nonexistent, there is still an extremely small amount of friction in space.

[Munsie]

Not to mention it would be impossible to position it perfectly still. The spinning magnet/object would eventually drift across space until it was picked up by a strong enough gravitational force to be pulled into a planet/moon/piece of space debris. At which point in time it would cease to be in motion, as it would have come to rest on said planet/moon/piece of debris in space.

[Danke]

I think the last time I heard about anything like this was the whole Steorn thing. Perpetual motion has already been proven to exist by utilizing well known methods like magic, unicorn blood, and of course wicca.

[shadowkhas]

@shadowkhas: Um? You have a metal marble in the air going around and around propelled by magnets.

"A "fixed" magnet can do work, but energy is dissipated in the process, typically weakening the magnet's strength over time." From the Wikipedia article you linked to.
Also, aren't we talking about

# A perpetual motion machine of the first kind produces strictly more energy than it uses giving the user Unlimited energy, thus violating the law of conservation of energy. Over-unity devices, that is, devices with a thermodynamic efficiency greater than 1.0 (unity, or 100%), are perpetual motion machines of this kind.

? So, you'd need to generate energy if we're talking about that.

[Munsie]

We're not talking about making more energy though, it's impossible as the article says. We're talking about using the same energy we had to start and maintaining it for... ever?

As for the magnets, I was under the impression those earth magnets also lasted forever? That or I've been decieved by Wikipedia.